Friend or Foe

Sidney · 13th April 2005, 19:16

They have been head to head for a few years; they have known each other for more than 15 years. One of them is well liked by young; perhaps energetic; unconventional; full of vitality; or even brave people. While another is more accepted by businesses; conventional; well thought in terms of making a lot of money; slow in speech or even with their fingers.

When the wealthy know you like them, they will enjoy the moment much longer; and when the not so wealthy know you like them they celebrate just enough in making sure time is not wasted to keep getting better.

Making money has nothing to do with whether you have good products; it is a better of how you promote your products with precise timings. More importantly, it is who you know. Once you have a lot of money you could even get away with some cheating, which is, of course not to cheat your customers but your “enemy”. To win is to cheat? There is a better word for it; how about “strategy”. In the history of mankind, to win a war you have to cheat a little in every battle. As long as you win at the end; you are a hero. The cheating part is forgotten eventually.

While AMD was winning the battles in several fronts in the last 12 months, the war in between AMD and Intel goes on with Intel still winning the war in “making money”. If you listen to what the analysts have to say (money market fund not overclockers), they are 100% in agreement to put money into Intel rather than AMD.

Why? They know AMD chips are better than Intel. But, they also know AMD does not know how to make money as good as they could make chips. So, while we, the PC enthusiasts embrace the Winchester, Venice and SLI in terms of bench markings. We remain the minority group until our beloved Chip Maker realizes winning the war is the goal.

On the other hand, I’d say I enjoy riding the waves of the ups and downs of AMD stocks.

DUR0N · 13th April 2005, 23:15

AMD is the good kind of corporation, one which knows how to make its product with the highest of skills, and when beating an opponent in a contest, makes some blurry pictures of the trophy whilst in a bar drinking like there is no tomorrow.
Let the accountants worry about the money and let the investors worry about their fund, they make good CPU's and all the rest is rant for people with to much money.

Sidney · 13th April 2005, 23:39

Accountants = accountable for how the money is spent.
Investors = people putting money into the Company including people pay for using the Processor, or you if own AMD processor

Quote:

AMD does not know how to make money as good as they could make chips.

Regarding

Quote:

they make good CPU's and all the rest is rant for people with to much money.

A company must have financial resources to design and focuses on Research & Development -- Processors do not grow from trees.

Sidney · 14th April 2005, 00:06

I should provide more clarify on the subject -

1) It only benefits the consumers (you and I) if both Companies; Intel & AMD are profitable.

2) I certainly don't want to see paying $200 AMD Processor only to find out there is a $50 going to finance the loss of Flash memory.

3) AMD and Intel are both public companies, meaning they sell stock at X times their future earnings. It also means they don't have to borrow money which they have to pay interest to sustain the business.

4) If the stock value is down; it will mean they have to borrow money from bank or they cut R&D or increase pricing. The later is unlikely because you will not be buying AMD processor or the first to complain high price.

Lastly, a good Corporation will always take good care of it's people by making sure the company is profitable so that they can pay for quality people, like you for example.

17th April 2005, 06:19

Good Mentioning on the way AMD and Intel operates its businesses and how important it is to win the battle in "making money".

And yes, i agree with lazy man that Intel knows how to increase its profits in terms of selling their CPUs, even if their Products arent the best. Intel have been pushing new technology for the PC in the last 10 years and its not going to change any time soon.(Think dual core and BTX and Intel Itanium2 )

With the introductions of PCI Express and its LAG socket processors, they added another "wow" effect for the enthusiasts to race for the best and the latest technology. Meanwhile spreading the hype to the main stream market. This strategy have been used by Intel ever since the Pentium 2 days.
Remeber when the first generation P4s came out? You have people camping outside major computer stores for its release.

I just hope AMD stops doing follow up and just introduce something that would just shock the PC world and make everyone jump off Intels band wagon.

Hint.... AMD processors more productive for businesses.
hey its a start, how many companys do you know that
uses AMD based computers? Me, i dont even know one.
Intel have that market share in between its jaws, and

Sidney · 17th April 2005, 06:36

Hey GotGAME;

I have one .... who agrees to my B/S.

T/Y

17th April 2005, 13:55

they don't confront Intel hard enough in advertising

they need to point out intels weaknesses without mercy

Plus they need to make dell's attempt to enter the gaming market (no more intel extrem graphics) look bad as they are only selling Intel right now and it's a joke to put a x850XT together with any Intel CPU.

17th April 2005, 17:02

The point is that dell has tried AMD and they never made the finish.
There is something about intel making a better product for these markets.
Dell doesn't care about power and preformance. Like any company, they are about sales. They get a good deal with intel, and intel makes them sell lots. Taking AMD in the lineup won't make their sales skyrocket (trust me, if it would they'd be selling them) But production and handeling costs DO increase. So why bother?

I've heard people say AMD is thinking too much from a PR standpoint instead of an engineering standpoint.
They say 64-bit would be a nice selling catchphrase. So the engineers just have to implement it, somehow.
Intel on the other hand has engineers telling the PR folk what they made, and the PR guys will make the best of it (see hyperthreading)

There is a limit however. Why intel hasn't dropped the entire P4 lineup in favor of their mobile series, I can only guess.

Enough ranting now. Got math to study.

Sidney · 23rd April 2005, 16:17

Image Venice core is readily available; many more will jump into S939 bandwagon.

Let's say the Dual Core AMD pricing is in-line with Intel's Dual Core, many will be saving money awaiting for June release.

AMD a smaller company has always been more innovative; unfortunately many supporters are budget minded. This is difficult to explain, while they look for lower price AMD processor they don't mind spending more on memory. The difference between reasonings and logic is well demonstrated here.

Neverthless, we all benefit from these two Companies competing with each other on a daily basis.

13th April 2005, 19:16	#1
Sidney Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 15,738	Friend or Foe They have been head to head for a few years; they have known each other for more than 15 years. One of them is well liked by young; perhaps energetic; unconventional; full of vitality; or even brave people. While another is more accepted by businesses; conventional; well thought in terms of making a lot of money; slow in speech or even with their fingers. When the wealthy know you like them, they will enjoy the moment much longer; and when the not so wealthy know you like them they celebrate just enough in making sure time is not wasted to keep getting better. Making money has nothing to do with whether you have good products; it is a better of how you promote your products with precise timings. More importantly, it is who you know. Once you have a lot of money you could even get away with some cheating, which is, of course not to cheat your customers but your “enemy”. To win is to cheat? There is a better word for it; how about “strategy”. In the history of mankind, to win a war you have to cheat a little in every battle. As long as you win at the end; you are a hero. The cheating part is forgotten eventually. While AMD was winning the battles in several fronts in the last 12 months, the war in between AMD and Intel goes on with Intel still winning the war in “making money”. If you listen to what the analysts have to say (money market fund not overclockers), they are 100% in agreement to put money into Intel rather than AMD. Why? They know AMD chips are better than Intel. But, they also know AMD does not know how to make money as good as they could make chips. So, while we, the PC enthusiasts embrace the Winchester, Venice and SLI in terms of bench markings. We remain the minority group until our beloved Chip Maker realizes winning the war is the goal. On the other hand, I’d say I enjoy riding the waves of the ups and downs of AMD stocks. __________________ lazyman Opteron 165 (2) @2.85 1.42 vcore AMD Stock HSF + Chill Vent II

14th April 2005, 00:06	#4
Sidney Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 15,738	I should provide more clarify on the subject - 1) It only benefits the consumers (you and I) if both Companies; Intel & AMD are profitable. 2) I certainly don't want to see paying $200 AMD Processor only to find out there is a $50 going to finance the loss of Flash memory. 3) AMD and Intel are both public companies, meaning they sell stock at X times their future earnings. It also means they don't have to borrow money which they have to pay interest to sustain the business. 4) If the stock value is down; it will mean they have to borrow money from bank or they cut R&D or increase pricing. The later is unlikely because you will not be buying AMD processor or the first to complain high price. Lastly, a good Corporation will always take good care of it's people by making sure the company is profitable so that they can pay for quality people, like you for example. __________________ lazyman Opteron 165 (2) @2.85 1.42 vcore AMD Stock HSF + Chill Vent II

17th April 2005, 06:36	#6
Sidney Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 15,738	Hey GotGAME; I have one .... who agrees to my B/S. T/Y __________________ lazyman Opteron 165 (2) @2.85 1.42 vcore AMD Stock HSF + Chill Vent II

23rd April 2005, 16:17	#9
Sidney Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 15,738	Image Venice core is readily available; many more will jump into S939 bandwagon. Let's say the Dual Core AMD pricing is in-line with Intel's Dual Core, many will be saving money awaiting for June release. AMD a smaller company has always been more innovative; unfortunately many supporters are budget minded. This is difficult to explain, while they look for lower price AMD processor they don't mind spending more on memory. The difference between reasonings and logic is well demonstrated here. Neverthless, we all benefit from these two Companies competing with each other on a daily basis. __________________ lazyman Opteron 165 (2) @2.85 1.42 vcore AMD Stock HSF + Chill Vent II

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13th April 2005, 23:15	#2
DUR0N Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,543	AMD is the good kind of corporation, one which knows how to make its product with the highest of skills, and when beating an opponent in a contest, makes some blurry pictures of the trophy whilst in a bar drinking like there is no tomorrow. Let the accountants worry about the money and let the investors worry about their fund, they make good CPU's and all the rest is rant for people with to much money.

17th April 2005, 06:19	#5
GotGAME Posts: n/a	Good Mentioning on the way AMD and Intel operates its businesses and how important it is to win the battle in "making money". And yes, i agree with lazy man that Intel knows how to increase its profits in terms of selling their CPUs, even if their Products arent the best. Intel have been pushing new technology for the PC in the last 10 years and its not going to change any time soon.(Think dual core and BTX and Intel Itanium2 ) With the introductions of PCI Express and its LAG socket processors, they added another "wow" effect for the enthusiasts to race for the best and the latest technology. Meanwhile spreading the hype to the main stream market. This strategy have been used by Intel ever since the Pentium 2 days. Remeber when the first generation P4s came out? You have people camping outside major computer stores for its release. I just hope AMD stops doing follow up and just introduce something that would just shock the PC world and make everyone jump off Intels band wagon. Hint.... AMD processors more productive for businesses. hey its a start, how many companys do you know that uses AMD based computers? Me, i dont even know one. Intel have that market share in between its jaws, and

17th April 2005, 13:55	#7
Rutar Posts: n/a	they don't confront Intel hard enough in advertising they need to point out intels weaknesses without mercy Plus they need to make dell's attempt to enter the gaming market (no more intel extrem graphics) look bad as they are only selling Intel right now and it's a joke to put a x850XT together with any Intel CPU.

17th April 2005, 17:02	#8
FreeStyler Posts: n/a	The point is that dell has tried AMD and they never made the finish. There is something about intel making a better product for these markets. Dell doesn't care about power and preformance. Like any company, they are about sales. They get a good deal with intel, and intel makes them sell lots. Taking AMD in the lineup won't make their sales skyrocket (trust me, if it would they'd be selling them) But production and handeling costs DO increase. So why bother? I've heard people say AMD is thinking too much from a PR standpoint instead of an engineering standpoint. They say 64-bit would be a nice selling catchphrase. So the engineers just have to implement it, somehow. Intel on the other hand has engineers telling the PR folk what they made, and the PR guys will make the best of it (see hyperthreading) There is a limit however. Why intel hasn't dropped the entire P4 lineup in favor of their mobile series, I can only guess. Enough ranting now. Got math to study.